Old Style Pannier Lock Wafers/Leaves & Pop Rivets

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SPJ
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Old Style Pannier Lock Wafers/Leaves & Pop Rivets

Postby SPJ » Thu May 11, 2017 7:36 pm

Mistakenly originally posted under, "Introduce Yourself." Moderator, feel free to remove it.

I have removed all the locks on my panniers after one fell out. It had no locking leaf while the spring was there; but buggered. I am having a devil of a time finding a replacement (see pic) with a spring so any help here would be gratefully accepted. I have read forums here on the locks and note that it is said that one can pull out the other wafers (1, 2 & 3's). I damaged the chromed cap removing it while looking for the pin holding them all in place. There was no pin so I tried pulling one wafer out without success. How much pressure can I exert in trying to pull one out? It would be great after reading Forum comments about filing down protruding leafs and parts of leafs to get everything sweet.

I also require a handful of the appropriate pop rivets with those wide heads for refastening locks, carrying handle brackets and hinges if anyone has an idea, many of the links in the old posts having expired. Many thanks and good to be here.
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Galactic Greyhound
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Re: Old Style Pannier Lock Wafers/Leaves & Pop Rivets

Postby Galactic Greyhound » Thu May 11, 2017 11:15 pm

See link:http://www.motobrick.com/index.php?topic=494.0

See 'Qdude' post « Reply #6 on: February 14, 2013, 02:20:46 AM »

".........Pull the wafers out of the cylinder straight in the direction that the spring is pushing, and yes the spring is in that alternating round hole at the end of the slots. It should come out like an old 8-track tape cassette with a small "spur" that keeps it seated (pull it in & out 10 times and it will no longer stay in having scraped a furrow in the cylinder), mind that spring by the way (I have not seen but one spring per wafer, just the two pieces)."

BMW had a repair kit for their locks (Lock Repair Kit Panniers) comprising of assorted wafers (and springs too - I think).
I don't know if it only applied to the locks on the newer models or not.
Suggest you contact Motorworks, Motobins or James Sherlock to see if they can supply it for your bike or sort you out with replacement locks and the rivets.
Ced.

R1100RT 1996.
Sent by Boson Quantum Transmission from the Starship 'Galahad'.
http://www.researchgate.net/publication ... ing_bosons" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; - It works!

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Re: Old Style Pannier Lock Wafers/Leaves & Pop Rivets

Postby SPJ » Fri May 12, 2017 9:29 am

Thank you. Contacted all those folks and while BMW advertise a bag with cylinder and leaves they replied that they don't do them!
No reply from Sherlock.
That was one of the pages that I read that prompted me to post as I am fearful of pulling too hard on a leaf and destroying it. You are sure that I should be able to pull them out on my type of cylinder? My pictures no longer appear?

Thank you for your response. Shaun.

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Re: Old Style Pannier Lock Wafers/Leaves & Pop Rivets

Postby Galactic Greyhound » Fri May 12, 2017 11:41 am

Hi Shaun,

I am not absolutely certain that the wafers can be pulled out of your cylinders but my understanding is that they can be.

The 'spur' on the wafer is what stops it from being pulled straight out.
I believe that you have to angle the wafer as you pull it out to get the spur clear of its recess and the wafer will come out - no force should be used.

Again, my understanding is that all the BMW cylinder locks are the same in respect of wafer removal/replacement.

If the only problem you have is keeping the cylinder retained in the housing because the 'lock' wafer is missing, then consider taking any wafer from the cylinder and use that as the 'lock' wafer - I think that may work.

Your local BMW Motorrad dealer should be able to get the 'Lock Repair Kit' for you but I have found that Motorworks will order a BMW part if you can supply them with the Part Number.

Failing that, purchase a used cylinder and experiment on that in removing the wafers.

I will check and see if I have a spare Topbox cylinder in my workshop which might do for you.

LATER EDIT:

Here is my old R1100RT Topbox cylinder lock.
The wafers and springs are retained in the cylinder when the key is inserted.
If the key is removed the wafers and springs just fall out.

The wafers look different from yours so maybe your cylinder is not built the same way?

Pics
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IMG_0820.JPG
IMG_0819.JPG
IMG_0818.JPG
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Ced.

R1100RT 1996.
Sent by Boson Quantum Transmission from the Starship 'Galahad'.
http://www.researchgate.net/publication ... ing_bosons" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; - It works!

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Re: Old Style Pannier Lock Wafers/Leaves & Pop Rivets

Postby SPJ » Fri May 12, 2017 5:25 pm

Galactic Greyhound thank you. James Sherlock has just come through stating that he has nothing that would help me. A spring from you would certainly help me and the pictures that you have kindly gone to the trouble of taking and posting have brought me to the conclusion that I should find a piece of inox or brass and file my own locking leaf as no one appears to have one in a kit that looks like mine. I'll pull another from another of the cylinders and see if that's the same.
Thanks for the advice on force. As I suspected and as I don't want to do damage anything (I have stripped enough threads and broken enough studs in my time) I'll just throw the lot in to a can of petrol, clean them, apply thin machine oil before refitting. I also have to modify the keys slightly as they hide all the leaves before the key bottoms out. Bit of pain pushing a key home and then withdrawing it 3mm to have everything correct.

So, if you could supply a spring or two (lest I f. up) I'd be grateful. I'm in Ibiza working but would, of course pay for the service (and supply an address).

Best, SPJ.

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Re: Old Style Pannier Lock Wafers/Leaves & Pop Rivets

Postby Galactic Greyhound » Fri May 12, 2017 6:34 pm

Hi SPJ,

I am happy to post my spare Topbox cylinder lock (missing one spring) to a UK address.

Alternatively, as the springs are so tiny, I can post a couple to you in Ibiza in an envelope.

Email me with an address and I'll get it sorted out. :smile:
Ced.

R1100RT 1996.
Sent by Boson Quantum Transmission from the Starship 'Galahad'.
http://www.researchgate.net/publication ... ing_bosons" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; - It works!

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Re: Old Style Pannier Lock Wafers/Leaves & Pop Rivets

Postby Galactic Greyhound » Fri May 12, 2017 6:37 pm

Hi SPJ,

I am happy to post my spare Topbox cylinder lock (missing one spring) to a UK address.

Alternatively, as the springs are so tiny, I can post a couple to you in Ibiza in an envelope.

Email me with an address and I'll get it sorted out. :smile:
Ced.

R1100RT 1996.
Sent by Boson Quantum Transmission from the Starship 'Galahad'.
http://www.researchgate.net/publication ... ing_bosons" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; - It works!

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george baker
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Re: Old Style Pannier Lock Wafers/Leaves & Pop Rivets

Postby george baker » Fri May 12, 2017 10:22 pm

hi
Bit of pain pushing a key home and then withdrawing it 3mm to have everything correct.
how about Putting a 3mm spacer between the key and the lock

george
Member 21, R100R, K75 and a Hyosung 250 FOR SALE

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Re: Old Style Pannier Lock Wafers/Leaves & Pop Rivets

Postby george baker » Mon Sep 04, 2017 4:16 pm

Hi
can someone please tell me how do you get the lock out

5 locks on a pair of panniers work with a key (I found, the panniers did not come with a key) but the 5th doesn't

George

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Re: Old Style Pannier Lock Wafers/Leaves & Pop Rivets

Postby Galactic Greyhound » Mon Sep 04, 2017 4:31 pm

Hi George,

See if the following helps - unfortunately some of the photos are no longer showing:
http://www.motobrick.com/index.php/topi ... 588aa440c5

If it's the cylinder type of lock with the wafers, then the 'lock' wafer which prevents the cylinder barrel from being withdrawn (when the key is fitted), is the wafer furtherest away from the keyhole.
This 'lock' wafer normally stays upright and is not operated/affected by the key.
The 'lock' wafer needs to be depressed while the key is in the cylinder for the cylinder to be withdrawn as inserting the key aligns all the remaining 'key' wafers so allowing the cylinder to be pulled out without the 'key' wafers and springs flying off when the cylinder is free.
The 'lock' wafer is depressed by inserting a small drill bit or similar (around 3mm dia) into an access hole in the latch handle body.
This access hole is there for the purpose of depressing the 'lock' wafer and is situated directly above it.
Note that the 'lock' wafer access hole is usually cover by the latch mechanism e.g. handle. So, if you don't have a key to raise the handle, you can't get to the 'lock' wafer access hole!

For a 'no key' situation, see my later post.

EDITED - 'Key' wafers clarified and 'no key' info.
Last edited by Galactic Greyhound on Mon Sep 04, 2017 5:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Ced.

R1100RT 1996.
Sent by Boson Quantum Transmission from the Starship 'Galahad'.
http://www.researchgate.net/publication ... ing_bosons" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; - It works!

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george baker
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Re: Old Style Pannier Lock Wafers/Leaves & Pop Rivets

Postby george baker » Mon Sep 04, 2017 4:46 pm

Hi
I will go and have a look on my spare panniers

BTW with 2 bikes and 3 sets of panniers I have taken to painting the surface of the lock with nail varnish and the key top to match, since over the years some locks have been replaced. It makes it a bit easier to find the correct key

But with 4 locks per bike, 3 sets of panniers, each with 3 locks and 2 sets of 2 fairing pockets I have run out of colours.

George
Member 21, R100R, K75 and a Hyosung 250 FOR SALE

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Re: Old Style Pannier Lock Wafers/Leaves & Pop Rivets

Postby Galactic Greyhound » Mon Sep 04, 2017 5:39 pm

IF YOU HAVE A KEY

Here is a video of lock cylinder removal from a 'System' case as fitted to Oilheads and possibly later K bikes:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WU8v6z77lH4

Here is a photoguide of lock cylinder removal from an older style case AND rekeying the lock to fit another key:
http://www.mototrip-tours.com/blog/work ... ase-locks/
I think these cases are what is fitted to the K75.


IF YOU DON'T HAVE A KEY

Here are some videos showing the special tool needed to depress a cylinder 'lock' wafer if you don't have a key and the pannier handle is locked down preventing access to the 'lock' wafer release hole or, on older cases, you can't access the inside to release the cylinder:
The 'lock' wafer function: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jf0TIOYxjjw
The 'lock' wafer depress tool (ground from hacksaw blade): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CyqACUI5qJE
Using the tool: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CCJ677blYzM
Ced.

R1100RT 1996.
Sent by Boson Quantum Transmission from the Starship 'Galahad'.
http://www.researchgate.net/publication ... ing_bosons" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; - It works!

SPJ
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Re: Old Style Pannier Lock Wafers/Leaves & Pop Rivets

Postby SPJ » Sat Sep 09, 2017 2:43 pm

Gents, Ladies, All, All done and dusted thanks to Motoworks who kindly sent me an old locking leaf and a couple of springs. Most difficult part was punching the soft metal of the barrel inwards after fitting the leaf in order to stop it flying out once it was in. Appears to be OK on all counts now.


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