Spring in Scotland

The new BM Riders Club Forum - OPEN TO ALL

Moderator: Moderators

Forum rules
This forum is for the benefit of BM Riders Club Members but is open for all to share so that you can see the advantages of becoming a Club Member which would then permit you to attend Club events.
User avatar
Galactic Greyhound
Moderator/Club Member
Posts: 9466
Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2010 11:26 pm
Country of Residence: Scotland
Location: Dumfries

Re: Spring in Scotland

Postby Galactic Greyhound » Thu Apr 17, 2014 9:29 am

George,

We have discussed it and I intend to do some ergonomic tests with her on the bike to determine where her feet need to be so that she is able to stand up to dismount without popping the knee joint (she can get on the bike normally). From that I will try and determine an engineering solution. Current thoughts are the possible use of rear footplates in lieu of the footrests.
Ced.

R1100RT 1996.
Sent by Boson Quantum Transmission from the Starship 'Galahad'.
http://www.researchgate.net/publication ... ing_bosons" - It works!

User avatar
george baker
Club Member 14
Posts: 7358
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2005 10:51 am
Country of Residence: uk
Location: Manchester,UK

Re: Spring in Scotland

Postby george baker » Thu Apr 17, 2014 9:39 am

HI
Dick had footplates on that K1100 he brought.

How about a second foot ped higher up? I have seen that done by a rider who had a standard sized passenger but took a child.

How about a ladder step on the side stand? I have seen that on a GS where the rider was too short to mount normally.

How about a second side stand? I had that when I had my Surefoot

How about a side stand on the otherside? That way she will be using the other knee.

How about an off-road knee brace? I have seen off roaders use them after an accident

More (Dark) Beer and experiments required I think.

How about asking NABD? They may have encountered the problem before

George
Member 21, R100R, and an unused K75

Twisty

Re: Spring in Scotland

Postby Twisty » Thu Apr 17, 2014 11:16 am

Hi
Yep!

Anglesey, Wales next, Who is coming? Sing up NOW!

George

We are going to make another attempt. :bounce: think I'm going to prevent Cally from eating for the week before [-X

:cool:

User avatar
Galactic Greyhound
Moderator/Club Member
Posts: 9466
Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2010 11:26 pm
Country of Residence: Scotland
Location: Dumfries

Re: Spring in Scotland

Postby Galactic Greyhound » Thu Apr 17, 2014 11:36 am

Hi
Yep!

Anglesey, Wales next, Who is coming? Sing up NOW!

George

We are going to make another attempt. :bounce: think I'm going to prevent Cally from eating for the week before [-X

:cool:
Hi Dave,

Sorry that you and Cally couldn't make Galloway - hope Cally is feeling better.
Hopefully Irene and I will meet up with you again at Anglesey if I can get things sorted this end.
Regards to the Scoobie! :grin:
Ced.

R1100RT 1996.
Sent by Boson Quantum Transmission from the Starship 'Galahad'.
http://www.researchgate.net/publication ... ing_bosons" - It works!

User avatar
ianl
Forum User
Posts: 590
Joined: Fri Sep 30, 2011 5:25 pm
Country of Residence: UK
Location: West Dorset

Re: Spring in Scotland

Postby ianl » Thu Apr 17, 2014 11:44 am

Hi Dave

Be good if you and Cally can make Anglesey. Has she ever tried using a sick bag whilst riding pillion? :-k :grin:

Ian
Ian


2007 R1200GS
The cause of most motorcycle faults is the nut that connects the handlebars to the seat

User avatar
george baker
Club Member 14
Posts: 7358
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2005 10:51 am
Country of Residence: uk
Location: Manchester,UK

Re: Spring in Scotland

Postby george baker » Thu Apr 17, 2014 11:55 am

Hi
Open face helmet?

George
Member 21, R100R, and an unused K75

Twisty

Re: Spring in Scotland

Postby Twisty » Thu Apr 17, 2014 12:17 pm

Has she ever tried using a sick bag whilst riding pillion? :-k :grin:

This is probably too much information - but it was the other end :oops:

Yes she is OK now thanks. Hopefully(!!) she'll be OK this time.

Now I have to arrange B&B for Scooby :-" I do wish he'd fit in the topbox :joker:

:cool:

User avatar
george baker
Club Member 14
Posts: 7358
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2005 10:51 am
Country of Residence: uk
Location: Manchester,UK

Re: Spring in Scotland

Postby george baker » Thu Apr 17, 2014 12:28 pm

Hi
thanks, just the correct amount of information although any more would be too much.

Are you booked in? I can not find a form from you two. If you say you have sent a payment I will search deeper

Poor Scooby, prision for him No, I mean Holiday Hotel or sleepover.

George
Member 21, R100R, and an unused K75

User avatar
Galactic Greyhound
Moderator/Club Member
Posts: 9466
Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2010 11:26 pm
Country of Residence: Scotland
Location: Dumfries

Re: Spring in Scotland

Postby Galactic Greyhound » Thu Apr 17, 2014 2:23 pm

HI
Dick had footplates on that K1100 he brought.

How about a second foot ped higher up? I have seen that done by a rider who had a standard sized passenger but took a child.

How about a ladder step on the side stand? I have seen that on a GS where the rider was too short to mount normally.

How about a second side stand? I had that when I had my Surefoot

How about a side stand on the otherside? That way she will be using the other knee.

How about an off-road knee brace? I have seen off roaders use them after an accident

More (Dark) Beer and experiments required I think.

How about asking NABD? They may have encountered the problem before

George
Thanks George,
Looking at this: http://www.motorcycleparts-hornig.com/B ... apter.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Ced.

R1100RT 1996.
Sent by Boson Quantum Transmission from the Starship 'Galahad'.
http://www.researchgate.net/publication ... ing_bosons" - It works!

User avatar
george baker
Club Member 14
Posts: 7358
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2005 10:51 am
Country of Residence: uk
Location: Manchester,UK

Re: Spring in Scotland

Postby george baker » Thu Apr 17, 2014 2:57 pm

HI
looks like it may do the job, the price is high but if it solves the problem worthwhile.

For me the problem would be, (if I wanted to use them) which length to buy

George
Member 21, R100R, and an unused K75

Twisty

Re: Spring in Scotland

Postby Twisty » Thu Apr 17, 2014 5:05 pm

Are you booked in? I can not find a form from you two. If you say you have sent a payment I will search deeper

Poor Scooby, prision for him No, I mean Holiday Hotel or sleepover.
Yup booked and paid. I've got a receipt from Paypal dated 12th Sept 2013 for £226.00. £116.00 for Galloway and £110 for Anglesea.

Hopefully Scooby will go to the 'Holiday Hotel' next door.

:cool:

User avatar
Lolo
Moderator
Posts: 3107
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2009 10:52 am
Country of Residence: Portugal

Re: Spring in Scotland

Postby Lolo » Thu Apr 17, 2014 6:51 pm

Oh bugger! found your payment wondered why Galloway had made a profit !!!! got to go and amend the accounts now ! I remember your payment I had to refund you as you paid twice just did not pick up you paid twice and it was for two events ! ](*,) ](*,) ](*,)

Edit

Just updated and noticed that the paypal actually says you have three payments for Galloway and none for Anglesey so have moved one of the payments accross.

See you soon :grin:
Living the dream :sunny:

User avatar
Galactic Greyhound
Moderator/Club Member
Posts: 9466
Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2010 11:26 pm
Country of Residence: Scotland
Location: Dumfries

Re: Spring in Scotland

Postby Galactic Greyhound » Thu Apr 17, 2014 8:26 pm

HI
looks like it may do the job, the price is high but if it solves the problem worthwhile.

For me the problem would be, (if I wanted to use them) which length to buy

George
Hi George,

I thought I would check to see if the 'Vario Footrest System' was available via Ebay - Bingo! :cheers:

M&P are selling it on Ebay here: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BMW-R-1100-RT ... 2ec49bd984" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

M&P are selling it as a complete package unlike Hornig where you buy the individual parts -
Hornig: http://www.motorcycleparts-hornig.com/B ... trest.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
There is a better description of the system on the Hornig site.

For anyone interested, the Vario Footrest System is in three parts:

1. The Driver or Pillion Vario Footrest System (this is the top part which fits into the existing frame footrest lugs) [specify if Driver or Pillion is required.

2. The Vario Plate (Adapter) (this is the link plate between the top part and the footrest) [specify which of the 3 Vario Plate lengths 23mm, 30mm and 50mm you require].

3. The Footrest (the existing footrest cannot be used) [specify which of the 2 Vario Footrests are required; Racing or Super Grip].

Here is how I determined the Vario Plate (Adapter) length:

1. I got Irene to sit on the pillion seat with the bike on the mainstand and measured her knee angle with her foot on the footrest. It was around 90 degrees.

2. Measured the distance from the ground to the top of the footrest. It was 450mm.

3. I was looking to increase the knee angle to put less strain on the knee joint when dismounting so reckoned on the Vario Plate needing to be the maximum size of 50mm which would also drop the footrest by 50mm making the ground to footrest height 450mm - 50mm = 400mm.

4. I set up a bucket to be 400mm high to simulate the new footrest position and measured the knee angle. It was 120 degrees instead of the original 90 degrees. I got Irene to try dismounting and she reported it to be much improved with less strain on the knee joint.

I would have chosen a longer Vario Plate but 50mm is the maximum size available. It was interesting to note that when I simulated a ground to footrest height of 340mm which would require a much longer Vario Plate the knee angle did not appear to change much from the 120 degrees.

I have ordered up the Vario Footrest System for the Pillion Passenger from M&P via Ebay with the 50mm long Vario Plate. Hopefully it will work out and let Irene enjoy the bike for a bit longer.
Ced.

R1100RT 1996.
Sent by Boson Quantum Transmission from the Starship 'Galahad'.
http://www.researchgate.net/publication ... ing_bosons" - It works!

User avatar
george baker
Club Member 14
Posts: 7358
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2005 10:51 am
Country of Residence: uk
Location: Manchester,UK

Re: Spring in Scotland

Postby george baker » Fri Apr 18, 2014 7:57 am

Hi Dave
like Lolo I found the payment,. Sorry for the confusion-- the blame is ALL mine.

Looking forward to seeing you. Extra campers as well

George
Member 21, R100R, and an unused K75

User avatar
george baker
Club Member 14
Posts: 7358
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2005 10:51 am
Country of Residence: uk
Location: Manchester,UK

Re: Spring in Scotland

Postby george baker » Fri Apr 18, 2014 8:03 am

Hi
Good news Ced, if it goes well it will be great to see Irene out on the bike. Let us know how it goes.

George
Member 21, R100R, and an unused K75

User avatar
Galactic Greyhound
Moderator/Club Member
Posts: 9466
Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2010 11:26 pm
Country of Residence: Scotland
Location: Dumfries

Re: Spring in Scotland

Postby Galactic Greyhound » Thu May 01, 2014 8:44 pm

Hi
Good news Ced, if it goes well it will be great to see Irene out on the bike. Let us know how it goes.

George
Here's an update on how Irene got on with the Vario Footrest System which replaced the BMW pillion footrests.

I fitted the Vario footrests with the 50mm Adapter Plate and Irene found the lowered footrests (50 mm lower) made it easier to mount the bike. Also, when sitting pillion on the bike she reckoned it was much more comfortable with the knee angle now increased from 90 deg to 120 deg.

However, when dis-mounting, although she said it was a bit easier, it still caused her problems mainly with rising before dismounting which put a lot of strain on her knees.

Further ergonomic analysis to ascertain how she actually dismounted, revealed that she first pushed herself forward using one hand on the topbox and one on my shoulder before rising. This led to a couple of 2 x 2 wood battens being clamped to the rear of the panniers by her hips at 45 deg to give her something to push on. This worked for her but caught her leg as she dismounted so the idea was scrapped.

Further testing, which concentrated on the pushing forward action, revealed that if she put both hands behind her on the BMW topbox such that her elbows were up and bent, there was no problem rising and dismounting.

A working test opportunity occurred with the trial Northern Meet Up to St. Mary's Loch on 30th April, a round distance of about 80 miles. No problems were encountered on the ride and the lower Vario pillion footrests were reported as being much more comfortable than the original footrests likely due to the increased knee angle they allowed which meant there was no constant niggling pain which she experienced before.

Things are therefore looking good for our next major ride to the Anglesey Event. :grin:
Ced.

R1100RT 1996.
Sent by Boson Quantum Transmission from the Starship 'Galahad'.
http://www.researchgate.net/publication ... ing_bosons" - It works!

User avatar
raesewell
Forum User
Posts: 1338
Joined: Mon May 07, 2012 9:48 pm
Country of Residence: England
Location: Normanton West Yorkshire

Re: Spring in Scotland

Postby raesewell » Thu May 01, 2014 9:13 pm

I'm glad the footrests worked out Ced, it will be good to see you both again at the Anglesey shindig

User avatar
Galactic Greyhound
Moderator/Club Member
Posts: 9466
Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2010 11:26 pm
Country of Residence: Scotland
Location: Dumfries

Re: Spring in Scotland

Postby Galactic Greyhound » Thu May 01, 2014 9:33 pm

Thanks Rae!

If Anglesey causes no knee problems I'll book for the hotel at Wheyrigg.
Ced.

R1100RT 1996.
Sent by Boson Quantum Transmission from the Starship 'Galahad'.
http://www.researchgate.net/publication ... ing_bosons" - It works!

User avatar
george baker
Club Member 14
Posts: 7358
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2005 10:51 am
Country of Residence: uk
Location: Manchester,UK

Re: Spring in Scotland

Postby george baker » Thu May 01, 2014 10:44 pm

Hi
I hope the two mods work and Irene can continue to carry on riding. BUT if the knee problems re-occure then you will get the chance to test your tent in Wheyrigg, otherwise you will have to test it on your lawn.

George
Member 21, R100R, and an unused K75

User avatar
boxerman
Site Admin/Club Member
Posts: 7488
Joined: Sat Jul 23, 2005 8:27 pm
Country of Residence: UK
Location: Leicester
Contact:

Re: Spring in Scotland

Postby boxerman » Thu May 01, 2014 10:48 pm

It may be a silly thought, Ced but has she tried sliding off with the bike on the sidestand?
Phil Hawksley 'The Boxer Man' - aka 'Dangermouse'
Member #1 Much modified R80G/S - a REAL one
Why not join the BM Riders Club @ http://www.bmridersclub.com
http://www.boxerman.co.uk
http://www.bmbikes.co.uk
https://twitter.com/boxermanphil for my Badger videos

User avatar
Galactic Greyhound
Moderator/Club Member
Posts: 9466
Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2010 11:26 pm
Country of Residence: Scotland
Location: Dumfries

Re: Spring in Scotland

Postby Galactic Greyhound » Thu May 01, 2014 11:11 pm

It may be a silly thought, Ced but has she tried sliding off with the bike on the sidestand?
She couldn't manage that with me on the bike Phil - the only way it did work was for me to get off the bike first, she then slid forward onto the rider seat and got off.......... until the Galloway Event rideout on the Saturday........ the whole bike tipped over the sidestand and dropped her on the ground......... I wasn't very pleased with her! :grin:

I think the problem occurred because there was a slight slope on the tarmac which put her centre of gravity when on the pillion over the sidestand and..... oops! It had happened before I knew it and I was standing right beside the bike......... we abandoned that method and when I investigated footplates the Vario Footrest System cropped up.

Looking good now though, so I'm very hopeful. She'd never said she was in pain even just riding pillion so the new footrests have relieved that as well.
Ced.

R1100RT 1996.
Sent by Boson Quantum Transmission from the Starship 'Galahad'.
http://www.researchgate.net/publication ... ing_bosons" - It works!

User avatar
boxerman
Site Admin/Club Member
Posts: 7488
Joined: Sat Jul 23, 2005 8:27 pm
Country of Residence: UK
Location: Leicester
Contact:

Re: Spring in Scotland

Postby boxerman » Thu May 01, 2014 11:15 pm

#-o :shock:

How about one of the adjustable metal crutches - could easily be strapped to the bike folded and the used to take weight from the knee during a dismount?
Phil Hawksley 'The Boxer Man' - aka 'Dangermouse'
Member #1 Much modified R80G/S - a REAL one
Why not join the BM Riders Club @ http://www.bmridersclub.com
http://www.boxerman.co.uk
http://www.bmbikes.co.uk
https://twitter.com/boxermanphil for my Badger videos

User avatar
Galactic Greyhound
Moderator/Club Member
Posts: 9466
Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2010 11:26 pm
Country of Residence: Scotland
Location: Dumfries

Re: Spring in Scotland

Postby Galactic Greyhound » Thu May 01, 2014 11:17 pm

Hi
I hope the two mods work and Irene can continue to carry on riding. BUT if the knee problems re-occure then you will get the chance to test your tent in Wheyrigg, otherwise you will have to test it on your lawn.

George
If I end up camping at Wheyrigg George, the tent will be WELL tested on my lawn first! :grin:

I got lots of tips from Ian [Ianl] and Keith [Ruralman] when they were camping at the Galloway Event.

My younger daughter was lending me the tent and came down for the weekend bringing it with her.......... of course, she forgot to take it out of the car boot before driving home again! #-o
Ced.

R1100RT 1996.
Sent by Boson Quantum Transmission from the Starship 'Galahad'.
http://www.researchgate.net/publication ... ing_bosons" - It works!

User avatar
Galactic Greyhound
Moderator/Club Member
Posts: 9466
Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2010 11:26 pm
Country of Residence: Scotland
Location: Dumfries

Re: Spring in Scotland

Postby Galactic Greyhound » Thu May 01, 2014 11:25 pm

#-o :shock:

How about one of the adjustable metal crutches - could easily be strapped to the bike folded and the used to take weight from the knee during a dismount?
The ergonomics testing showed that she needs to push herself upwards and forwards as she rises on the footrest.

I'm not sure if that would be possible with a single crutch but is an option to try if there are any future problems.

I think the 'two-hands on the topbox' solution we have discovered along with the Vario footrests might have solved the problem.... at least for the time being!

Thanks for the thought!
Ced.

R1100RT 1996.
Sent by Boson Quantum Transmission from the Starship 'Galahad'.
http://www.researchgate.net/publication ... ing_bosons" - It works!

User avatar
ianl
Forum User
Posts: 590
Joined: Fri Sep 30, 2011 5:25 pm
Country of Residence: UK
Location: West Dorset

Re: Spring in Scotland

Postby ianl » Fri May 02, 2014 9:28 am

Good news Ced. Look forward to meeting up again in Anglesey and definately need more campers to join me in Cumbria. :cheers:

Ian
Ian


2007 R1200GS
The cause of most motorcycle faults is the nut that connects the handlebars to the seat


Return to “BM Riders Club”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests